3rd Wave feminism

Let’s face it.

The current wave of feminism, by definition, is NOT feminism. Instead in today’s society the movement of women are stronger and men are inferior is being pushed extremely hard. Feminism is the movement for the equality of men and women, by definition. 3rd wave feminism is pushing for inequality and women supremacy more than the textbook definition, no matter what people say.

When you dress up as something you try to turn all the attention away from in today's society, you bring attention to that. Im not going to mention it here due to fear of breaking some sort of NSFW rule, but I bet you guys can guess by my reference and context clues what im talking about. There's a reason feminists are the butt of most jokes.

But feminists can clean up their act! Here's how.

Advocate for women's rights in countries that women are actually oppressed in.

Let's get this straight. Women are anything but oppressed in america or any 1st world countries at this point. If you look at the middle east, women there are actually oppressed. Hell, its a HUGE celebration for everyone that women are allowed to drive over there in saudi arabia. I mean, come on. Give me 2 ways women dont have equal rights in today's society. 2 ways is all I ask. Women in other countries need all the help we can give them, not here. Its only perspective here in the us, while in those other countries its actual law.

So just to end this thread, feminists, step up.
-You need to stop complaining about a BS ideology that you're oppressed.
-Stop trying to make women have more power than men in society.
-Step up with actual textbook definition feminism for countries where women are oppressed. Islam is not a religion of peace. Modified islam is.

I rest my case.

 

Women may not be "oppressed" by your definition but that doesn't mean they don't face sexual assault, rape culture, and men trying to silence women. Third wave feminism is about trying to fight all of that and in a position of patriarchal power we men should listen to the concerns of women in society, and not control decisions for women especially about their reproductive lives.
We should be allies to women trying to breakdown sexist barriers and not belittle them for wanting to do so.
Those radical crazies are just that, radical crazies, and it shouldn't define the entire movement that women are trying to fight for better treatment in society.
And of course feminism should be fought for everywhere for all types of women, but how come along the way our own society can't fix sexist polices that we have towards women in our own country?
Just because the sexism is less obvious, doesn't mean it doesn't exist.

 

I agree, there are some women who are taking this too far but most of what you said isn't valid. Most of us are saying that we're as strong as men, not stronger than them or weaker. All I want is equality between men and women but it really still isn't equal.

Examples:

1. It's unfair that men are trying to make abortions illegal. It's something that mainly affects a women's life and her body. I would seriously rather "kill" my child than to put it up for adoption. But then again, I'm not dumb to the point that I'm gonna get pregnant by accident.

2. There is a huge amount of evidence that a women will get paid less while working because she has children. For men, this is the opposite. If they have children they get bigger paychecks. Also, a lot of women have to take care of the house, take care of their children, and still go to work. I know that there are men who do these types of things too but they still end up getting bigger paychecks.

3. Sexual assaults and rapes still happen on a daily basis every single day. Yes, this can happen to a man, but it mostly happens to a woman because of her gender. Also, there are people who still try to silence women and judge them too. At this point, when girl bands release songs about empowerment men take it as an insult when it's not. Men have become sensitive and feel like they're being threatened by the fact that women feel empowered and strong. Also, Donald Trump said, "If Hillary Clinton can't satisfy her husband what makes her think she can satisfy America.". You seriously support a man that insulted a woman countless times and then want to tell people, "There's nothing wrong here anymore, let's move on.". Our own president is an example of why we still need feminism in this country.

Advocate for women's rights in the United States because that still matters.

Let's get this straight. You have a profile picture supporting Donald Trump's campaign for president. You voted for a president that said, and I quote,"I believe in a foreign policy based on our national interests focusing on American security and regional..#AmericaFirst". You support a president that only wants to focus on this country but you want us to focus feminism in a different country other than America? And by the way, I gave you more than two ways with my examples.

Your whole post is hypocritical. You're saying, "Women in other countries need all the help we can give them, not here." but you don't wanna help Mexicans or Muslims from other countries who need help that you won't give them. Why focus on other countries when you voted for a president who swore that he would focus on America and make it "Great again"? Anyways, there are bigger problems to worry about than feminism even though it's still a problem. Next time be careful with what you say and have a good day.

 

Besides a few extreme tv shows, where the heck is rape being encouraged? We do not live in a rape culture, we are from such a thing. If you want a rape culture go to the middle east or even the uk where that type of crime is increasing due to the refugees theyre letting in. Everyone faces sexual assault, even men. Women will always face more due to nature of men, which unfortunately is something a simple movement cant stop nor even really decrease.

Let me break down your points.

1. I completely agree. Less government control is a huge favoritism of mine. This should be the case for that. I may be right leaning but im for abortion.

2. Funnily enough I wasnt going to include the myth that is the gender wage gap because I thought nobody still believed that myth. I guess I was proven wrong..
Here we go:

Firstly, there is a hypothetical wage gap between the only two genders. However, that does NOT mean women are paid less than men. Not. At. All. Women take and have less paying jobs than men do. Not only that right, its COMPLETELY ILLEGAL to pay a woman less than a man for their services. And not only that though, wouldn't it just be logical to hire more women to do jobs since they would be payed less? No way.

Despite what you see in the media, the big company CEOs are majority liberal, Mark Zuckerberg being a highlight example. Do you really think that things like this would slide under today's society, where if this happened even at a tiny restaurant, it would make every single headline on every major news outlet. CNN & other news sites feast off division in america, and do everything they can to make something small into a huge debate.

And aside from all that as well, do you think a company would risk doing so? I doubt there is any major US company that does that solely due to the fact that they could possibly be sued for it, put in jail for it, have their stocks plummet immensely, or even get shut down. It would be a highly idiotic move for a company to consciously pay women less soley due to their gender.

To conclude that, yes the wage gap is real, but the idea that women are payed less due to gender is a false statement. You have to take things like jobs women have, effort, and other things as well.

3. Those first two sentences are absolutely true. However after that you start to lose me. People silence eachother regardless of gender. If a man is silenced by women, everyone thinks the woman is strong and stands for herself and is very brave. However, reverse the roles and the media and left has a hissyfit. "Oh women are more frail, they feel uncomfortable around men who are shushing them". Do you realize how contradictory statements like those are though. Its the left generalizing women. Exactly what they prevent others from doing though.

Oh and by the way, he didnt say that, Sawyer Burmeister said it as a political joke.

4 (The bold text and under). Trump was talking about foreign policy, which includes things relating mostly to the economy. Trump and most of the right advocate for staying out of the other countries' business. However, this is completely different. You all want to fix womens' rights, so why not do it in a country where they actually need help? The entire right and trump also agrees with this. We want to put america first but also help others outside of the country not for our own benefit, but for the freedom we die for.

As to your sentence for muslims and mexicans, thats a completely false statement. We want to secure americans before anything else, however if there was a way to let the good guys in, we would most certainly advocate for it. Before we focus on legal immigration, we have to focus on cutting illegal immigration. I think everybody regardless of political agrees that we need a way to have more legal immigrants, and I feel like in order to do that illegal immigration needs to be cut. Once it is, legal immigration can be a more full focus, and the more legal immigrants certainly the better. Once again, America first does not mean america only. It means we have to prioritize american issues over other country issues, but try to help other countries in the process with the extra time and dedication we would have.

Feel free to respond, I don't normally respond to thread comments on here, but you're pretty interesting to debate. Unlike some members on here, I like you dont sugarcoat things to make yourself sound better. Respect from me for that.

 

I would conclude the "wage gap" you described as an earnings gap rather than a wage gap.
Other than that, I mainly agree with what you've said.

 

Yeah, could’ve worded that differently. In essence what I meant though haha.

 

ive tried to debate with feminists many times. actual debating, not just flaming and making up facts.

every one of those (3) times, i've either been blocked or flamed. one of my girlfriends friends is an extreme feminist, she's 12 and is already raising money and holding school meetings for feminism. i find it stupid how one of the first things she said to me was that i was interrupting her. that's when i knew she was like the others. she brought up the usual, the wage gap, sexual assault, slut shaming. i countered all of them and compared it to the way that some people in black lives matter were handling their cause.

she ends up blocking me and my girlfriend sends me screenshots of the feminist telling my girlfriend that im racist and sexist and homophobic, the usual shit. when she asked for screenshots, the feminist said that she couldnt get them. complete bullshit, we both know how instagram works.

she's 12, guys.

 

Newton's 3rd law. Gl reading through all this, props if you make it.

Just because inequality in America isn't as widespread as in other countries doesn't mean it doesn't exist. Certainly I agree that other countries require more immediate attention but as long as inequality exists women have in America have the right to fight against it.

• The US never ratified the Equal Rights Amendment (US constitution proposed law) to guarantee equal rights regardless of sex
• The US is one of the 6 countries to have not ratified or acceded the Convention on the Elimination of All Forms of Discrimination Against Women (UN treaty)

Thus nationally and internationally the US does not recognise the guarantee of women's rights at all(which I think is a few more than 2 way

Idk where this rape culture idea came from. Neither the US or UK have it and I find it hard to believe that it exists even the most corrupt countries as a majority.

• It is true that rape is more prevalent in the UK than the US. However the US still ranks 13th for rapes per person (2014)http://www.nationmaster.com/country-info/compare/United-Kingdom/United-States/Crime and 8 of those above are only estimates (including UK) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rape_statistics
• Statistically most Middle East countries have better rape rates than the US (see link above, although I'm certain conditions and legal rights are far worse
• Rape in the UK has nothing to do with immigration. 'At the end of 2016 just over a quarter of the prison population was from a non-white ethnic group – this figure has stayed relatively constant since 2005.' - researchbriefings.files.parliament.uk/documents/SN04334/SN04334.pdf

1. Although the wage gap is smaller than statistics or the media show, it does exist and the biggest reason is most likely as you said that women have lower paid jobs. Have you not considered this is the problem not an excuse? Like I said in our last debate, there's no way a woman aiming for a higher-paid job wouldn't take it if offered and yet the ratio of men:women having these jobs is ridiculous.
2. The wage gap almost certainly isn't within each company, otherwise it would be obvious. What the problem is is that in one company a man is being paid more than a woman in another company for doing the same job. Neither companies would realise, which is why spreading awareness, be it through feminism or not is important.
3. Didn't stop Sports Direct from paying all of their workers below minimum wage or FIFA from bribery and fraud. Again I doubt the wage gap is for the most part conscious.
4. @Nnoah can you confirm what you mean by 'effort' so that I don't get it confused with something else and rant about nothing.

I won't go completely into your political viewpoint because that's a different topic, but I think these few statements are debatable for many of those supporting Trump and including Trump and Pence themselves.

Oh boy... Tf does this have to do with feminism first off? I'm not going to start a war here because again this is off-topic. I'll put this link though as it's a great debate anyway but also explains a lot of my points better than I can without me having to list them, getting others to respond.

All sources are Government official (besides one world-leading university research), but if you want confirmation of any let me know.

 

Except when the inequality isn't a result of society but instead the result of people's personalities. Men are more likely to take risks than women, so they obviously are more likely go-getters. Meanwhile, women tend to take care of the children (And no, I'm not saying that it's all women or men, but that it's our biological tendencies.)

So you expect credible info to be a inherently biased feminist organization whose source is themselves? So I dug further, and their point was that both male and female scientists were more likely to choose males to hire even with equal credentials. Interesting. Unfortunately, its pointless for feminists to yell at both men and women and say they have biases.... because they have biases.... either way, it isn't something feminism can change.

So what? Companies should be held accountable by feminists for not having the same pay as another company? A job isn't a specific fixed price across companies. If a company wants a good worker, they'll up their requirements and up the pay.

1. And they should be held accountable by law.
2. If the wage gap is unconscious, then it's kind of impossible for feminists to change the unconscious without psychoanalyzing EVERY SINGLE EXISTENT PERSON.

Anything I didn't comment on I either agreed with, or didn't feel I had a say in the matter.

 

You do realize that income inequality is due to economical mechanics, and not sexism, right? Men typically choose much higher paying jobs than women, and that earns them more income. Companies can choose to raise incomes of more productive workers, which can be men, but not always. Just read any economics book on macroeconomics.

Tell me, if women are paid less, then why don’t companies just fire the men and hire only women?

 

Very good point. Not entirely sure how I managed to make that mistake but I clearly mucked up somewhere so if anyone else is reading ignore this graph.

Not at all. If feminists or anyone else can spread awareness, then it wouldn't be too difficult for employers to just check their pay for each of their employees against others within their company and other companies to confirm their pay is reasonable. The difference wouldn't necessarily be much but it would certainly help.

First that would be stupid. Second as I already put I don't think the wage gap is caused by men leaving a job and being replaced by women getting paid less.

The word 'choose' bothers me a bit. Although again I recognise more men aim for jobs with a higher pay than women I am convinced (based from personal experience and all the people I've ever known applying for said jobs) that the number ratio of female job applicants to those accepted is much larger than that of men unless proven otherwise by government data.

I do concede in general that my knowledge of economics isn't good and therefore your points have more stead there

 

I know I probably shouldn't get involved in this but please shut up about feminism and politics and stupid crap in general. First of all instead of complaining about not having rights look at the Middle East for Christ sakes. You complain about the wage gap yet you still stay with your job. The thing is God created us equally but there were people that wrote on a piece of paper stating what you can or can't do. You don't actually have to obey what that says but it's you who chooses to listen to it. I wouldn't mind feminism if it was for women in the Middle East, but protesting things in the United States. Like seriously come on. I'd be happy being a woman in America. You have all the freedoms in the world but you still complain because it's not enough for you. If you get hit by a man he's the one that will usually get in trouble not you. Laws don't tell you what you can or can't do its you who chooses. Plus you feminists have more rights than women back in the past in this country so please just stop complaining. And no I'm not saying that men are better than women at all it's just getting old hearing the same old argument over why women should have equal rights yet you make the men seem like the bad gender. Not all feminists do this but please don't complain over something as petty as this. (Haha I'm gonna get attacked by hella people but let's hear it I'm interested in the responses and also props to the people who actually read the nonsense in this essay like post)